What Brand Motor Oil Do You Use In Your 6th Gen?

[NotApplicable]

Based on this report Mobile 1 0w20 ESP is ILSAC GF-6A.


https://pqia.org/mobil-1-advanced-fuel-economy-0w-20-advanced-full-synthetic-motor-oil/

Thats Mobil 1 AFE (Advanced Fuel Economy) 0w-20, which is indeed ILSAC GF-6A.

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[CO/ZA]

Did an oil service with 0w-30 ESP, as I wanted to go up to -30 to cover the hot temperature, high altitude, high load conditions of off road Colorado mountain passes.

Even in my garage the engine sounds much smoother than on dealership 0w-20, only some injector and high pressure fuel pump noise.

This one is rated API SQ, which supersedes SP.

API SQ has all the same tests as ILSAC GF-7A, but does cover more viscosity ranges.
https://www.chevronlubricants.com/e...nt/understanding-the-new-api-sq-category.html

GF7A far exceeds GF6A for performance, and more closely aligns with euro spec.

 

[NotApplicable]

Did an oil service with 0w-30 ESP, as I wanted to go up to -30 to cover the hot temperature, high altitude, high load conditions of off road Colorado mountain passes.

Even in my garage the engine sounds much smoother than on dealership 0w-20, only some injector and high pressure fuel pump noise.

This one is rated API SQ, which supersedes SP.

API SQ has all the same tests as ILSAC GF-7A, but does cover more viscosity ranges.
https://www.chevronlubricants.com/e...nt/understanding-the-new-api-sq-category.html

GF7A far exceeds GF6A for performance, and more closely aligns with euro spec.

It's a fine oil, but for those who are wondering:

Meeting/exceeding API S{N,P,Q} engine test requirements does not mean it meets/exceed the full API S{N,P,Q} specification. For example, you can pass engine tests without conforming to the formulation/additive requirements of the specification. So this would technically be both out of spec (or rather, not carrying the spec; it may conform, but it doesn't claim to) and out of viscosity grade vs. what is "officially" recommended in the manual.

Does that mean it will hurt the engine? No, but just speaking to the details here.

 

[SouthCoast]

It's a fine oil, but for those who are wondering:

Meeting/exceeding API S{N,P,Q} engine test requirements does not mean it meets/exceed the full API S{N,P,Q} specification. For example, you can pass engine tests without conforming to the formulation/additive requirements of the specification. So this would technically be both out of spec (or rather, not carrying the spec; it may conform, but it doesn't claim to) and out of viscosity grade vs. what is "officially" recommended in the manual.

Does that mean it will hurt the engine? No, but just speaking to the details here.

What’s in the manual becomes irrelevant when international manuals allow up to 10w30

Did an oil service with 0w-30 ESP, as I wanted to go up to -30 to cover the hot temperature, high altitude, high load conditions of off road Colorado mountain passes.

Even in my garage the engine sounds much smoother than on dealership 0w-20, only some injector and high pressure fuel pump noise.

This one is rated API SQ, which supersedes SP.

API SQ has all the same tests as ILSAC GF-7A, but does cover more viscosity ranges.
https://www.chevronlubricants.com/e...nt/understanding-the-new-api-sq-category.html

GF7A far exceeds GF6A for performance, and more closely aligns with euro spec.

I’m switching to ESP 5w30 on Sunday.

 

[CO/ZA]

It's a fine oil, but for those who are wondering:

Meeting/exceeding API S{N,P,Q} engine test requirements does not mean it meets/exceed the full API S{N,P,Q} specification. For example, you can pass engine tests without conforming to the formulation/additive requirements of the specification. So this would technically be both out of spec (or rather, not carrying the spec; it may conform, but it doesn't claim to) and out of viscosity grade vs. what is "officially" recommended in the manual.

Does that mean it will hurt the engine? No, but just speaking to the details here.

The Chevron article spells it out better than I can: https://www.chevronlubricants.com/e...nt/understanding-the-new-api-sq-category.html

API SQ is a better, more stringent spec than SP.

SQ has all the same tests as ILSAC GF-7, but also accounts for 0w-08/12/16 oils as well as 5w-X0.

The SQ/GF7 standards are in alignment and are virtually interchangeable.


API SQ represents significantly enhanced protection features relative to its predecessor, API SP. The certification process entailed updates and improvements to the engine testing sequences used to evaluate lubricant performance, including:

• Sequence IIH, used to measure high-temperature viscosity increases and deposit levels.
• Sequence VH, which measures an oil’s ability to control low-temperature engine deposits.
• Sequence VI, which evaluates an oil’s fuel economy benefit.

...

The release of API SQ coincides with the introduction of the ILSAC GF-7 standards, developed by the International Lubricants Standardization and Approval Committee. API and ILSAC standards are generally in close alignment, and that is the case with API SQ and GF-7. API SQ, however, will address ultra-low viscosity grades that are not covered by the GF-7 standard. Both GF-7 and API SQ oils will be backwards compatible for vehicles using GF-6 and API SP oils.


Like SouthCoast said, Toyota only mentions 0w-20 in the US because of CAFE requirements. Everywhere else in the world a T24A engine'd vehicle resides gets 5w-30 most cases.

 

[Joe Dirt]

Just throw a bottle of slick 50 in there.

 

[NotApplicable]

The Chevron article spells it out better than I can: https://www.chevronlubricants.com/e...nt/understanding-the-new-api-sq-category.html

API SQ is a better, more stringent spec than SP.

SQ has all the same tests as ILSAC GF-7, but also accounts for 0w-08/12/16 oils as well as 5w-X0.

The SQ/GF7 standards are in alignment and are virtually interchangeable.


API SQ represents significantly enhanced protection features relative to its predecessor, API SP. The certification process entailed updates and improvements to the engine testing sequences used to evaluate lubricant performance, including:

• Sequence IIH, used to measure high-temperature viscosity increases and deposit levels.
• Sequence VH, which measures an oil’s ability to control low-temperature engine deposits.
• Sequence VI, which evaluates an oil’s fuel economy benefit.

...

The release of API SQ coincides with the introduction of the ILSAC GF-7 standards, developed by the International Lubricants Standardization and Approval Committee. API and ILSAC standards are generally in close alignment, and that is the case with API SQ and GF-7. API SQ, however, will address ultra-low viscosity grades that are not covered by the GF-7 standard. Both GF-7 and API SQ oils will be backwards compatible for vehicles using GF-6 and API SP oils.


Like SouthCoast said, Toyota only mentions 0w-20 in the US because of CAFE requirements. Everywhere else in the world a T24A engine'd vehicle resides gets 5w-30 most cases.

I agree SQ satisfies ILSAC 7 and therefore 6A if it is of a viscosity that ILSAC certifies, which 0W-30 is.

But, this bottle doesn’t state the oil satisfies API SQ. It states that it satisfies API SQ engine test requirements, which is a portion of the spec.

I’m not commenting on whether or not someone “should” run this oil or whether or not it’s “good.” Just that the bottle doesn’t state that it meets all of API SQ. You’ll notice that oils that do meet the full spec don’t include the words “engine test requirements.” I’ve attached the ESP data sheet - you’ll notice there are separate rows for “engine test requirements” vs full specs being met. The ESP 5W-30, for example, meets the full API SQ spec (and therefore ILSAC 6A/7).

And, as for the whole “international versions” debate- I’ve looked at all the global longitudinal T24A-FTS manuals I could get my hands on (so that’s J250 in Eastern Europe/Middle East), and that manual allows for ILSAC-6A 5W-30 max, with the same wording as our manual allows for 5W-20 (something something must be changed out for 0W-20 at next oil fill).

 

[CO/ZA]

I agree SQ satisfies ILSAC 7 and therefore 6A if it is of a viscosity that ILSAC certifies, which 0W-30 is.

But, this bottle doesn’t state the oil satisfies API SQ. It states that it satisfies API SQ engine test requirements, which is a portion of the spec.

I’m not commenting on whether or not someone “should” run this oil or whether or not it’s “good.” Just that the bottle doesn’t state that it meets all of API SQ. You’ll notice that oils that do meet the full spec don’t include the words “engine test requirements.” I’ve attached the ESP data sheet - you’ll notice there are separate rows for “engine test requirements” vs full specs being met. The ESP 5W-30, for example, meets the full API SQ spec (and therefore ILSAC 6A/7).

And, as for the whole “international versions” debate- I’ve looked at all the global longitudinal T24A-FTS manuals I could get my hands on (so that’s J250 in Eastern Europe/Middle East), and that manual allows for ILSAC-6A 5W-30 max, with the same wording as our manual allows for 5W-20 (something something must be changed out for 0W-20 at next oil fill).

It is unclear what this distinction means exactly, what else would it be besides an engine requirement test? I can't help but wonder if this is just a licensing question as we're apparently in the midst of an API SP -> SQ transition phase.

That being said, the specs are comparable, and the VW504 and MB229.52 round out the API and ILSAC rating. The -30 rating gives the greater HTHS value I'm looking for.

VW504 is tested in 16 different VWAG engines for 700hrs, and they've known about LSPI for 2 decades at this point. It seems that API/ILSAC finally caught up.

 

[josiahg52]

My actual position is to use Euro spec oils, as they exceed API and ILSAC standards - hence my pushing the 0w-20 ESP that costs the same as any other Mobil 1.

ILSAC GF-6 is a 5-6yr old spec now, and so long as an oil meets API SP it's effectively the same. In fact, GF-6A coincided with SN+.

The Mobil 1 ESP oils meet API SQ, which is better than both.

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/anyone-see-api-sq.398459/#post-7328685

Besides that, the VW508 and MB229.71 specs are more stringent than either.

I agree with you there. The ESP Formula was an excellent diesel oil and I bought every 12L case I could find when I learned it was being discontinued years ago and I have one more change left for my 200k X5. The current ESP is also very good diesel oil and excellent gasoline oil, but I I'm likely switching to Schaeffer's 5W30 mid-SAPS oil after that. Schaeffer's has some oils worth looking into.

 

[EricGrizz]

I must say my friend only recommended me amsoil & liqui moly and hes been working on cars his entire life. First oil change at 1k done with liqui moly molygen new generation 0w20

 

[MikeD]

Again, Toyota does not give any sort of specification beyond "use 0w-20 in normal conditions".

You have a good plan here, but the German auto builder specifications will exceed/trump anything you find in the API, JASO, or ILSAC worlds.

Mobil 1 0w-20 ESP is available at Walmart for like $26 / 5qts

I want to thank @CO/ZA , @NotApplicable and @josiahg52 for an oil education. Interesting discussion. I had no idea what ILSAC GF-6A meant until this thread.

BTW - I've been on the 4K miles change cycle and plan to continue. I think I've decided to go with Mobil 1 0w-20 ESP or Mobil 1 0w-20 AFE which are easy to get on Amazon and in the $25 range for 5 quarts. I don't think I've seen anything in this thread to motivate to a different brand from the one that Toyota uses (I would assume that Toyota branded oil (which I used for second and third change and I assume the dealer used for the first and 4th change) is the Mobile 1 AFE or something close to it??)
I might get a case of 6 individual quart bottles and use one for each change with a 5 quart bottle to avoid measuring. (someone tell me if this is dumb?)

 

[CO/ZA]

I want to thank @CO/ZA , @NotApplicable and @josiahg52 for an oil education. Interesting discussion. I had no idea what ILSAC GF-6A meant until this thread.

BTW - I've been on the 4K miles change cycle and plan to continue. I think I've decided to go with Mobil 1 0w-20 ESP or Mobil 1 0w-20 AFE which are easy to get on Amazon and in the $25 range for 5 quarts. I don't think I've seen anything in this thread to motivate to a different brand from the one that Toyota uses (I would assume that Toyota branded oil (which I used for second and third change and I assume the dealer used for the first and 4th change) is the Mobile 1 AFE or something close to it??)
I might get a case of 6 individual quart bottles and use one for each change with a 5 quart bottle to avoid measuring. (someone tell me if this is dumb?)

Your dealer might use Toyota rebranded OEM, or they might just have barrels of ordinary Mobil 1 / Valvoline / Pennzoil back there. The Toyota stuff is Mobil 1 made to Toyota's specifications, which includes high moly and boron content.

The VW dealer I went to in Houston used Pennzoil instead of the re-branded Castrol stuff.

 

[127.0.0.1]

hope ya'll realize that half the moving bits in this motor are hydraulic powered
and what is that fluid ? motor oil. it's not just for lubing, it's for synchronizing
cam phasers (VVTI) piston cooling jets, lash adjusters, chain tensioner, variable
oil pump..and the ECU sends commands to the OCV's programmed and based on it being 0-20 weight. so yeah it will run on 5w-20 but ya know...'jus sayin...

it has many advancements in bearing coatings to better handle some degree
of fuel dilution and make best use of zddp

 

[CO/ZA]

hope ya'll realize that half the moving bits in this motor are hydraulic powered
and what is that fluid ? motor oil. it's not just for lubing, it's for synchronizing
cam phasers (VVTI) piston cooling jets, lash adjusters, chain tensioner, variable
oil pump..and the ECU sends commands to the OCV's programmed and based on it being 0-20 weight. so yeah it will run on 5w-20 but ya know...'jus sayin...

it has many advancements in bearing coatings to better handle some degree
of fuel dilution and make best use of zddp

No car maker is going to hard code their ECU for 0w-20 only, it's just bad engineering and people like TCCN are simply wrong about it what is actually the case.

The module for the oil pump is going to look at variables and vary the oil pressure/flow rate accordingly, https://toyota-club.net/files/faq/21-09-20_faq_t24-engine_en.htm

It is not as simple as: If oil =/= 0w-20 then throw rod through engine block.

Consider the following:

Toyota manufactures a 2.4T Tacoma in Mexico, and we pick 2 examples of the same truck.

One is sent to Laredo, TX and one is sent to Ciudad Juarez.

The one sitting at the dealership in Laredo, Texas USA has an owners manual that says to use 0w-20 for best starting in cold weather and fuel economy.

The one sitting in Mexico has an owners manual that says use anything from 0w-20 to 10w-30 semi-synthetic.

They're separated by 10 miles and a national border.

Guess which law is influencing 0w-20?

**CAFE**



I'm running 0w-30 at 8500ft elevation doing heavy off roading, and nothing has happened so far other than the engine is smoother.

 

[BadTrainDriver]

Nothing I love better than a bunch of geeks discussing oil! I mean that in the most respectful way.

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