Outrageous dealer prices currently

[johnd]

I was lured by a dealership in Las Vegas under the premise that they had allocation for a TRD Pro. Ended up marking up $23,000 above MSRP. Absolutely ridiculous.

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[ModernDay4Runner]

Are you sure there was not a misunderstanding? Nobody on this forum has posted anything near $23k above MSRP.

 

[Crankpin]

We have the option to shop. Do your homework, decide exactly what you want, if you take what they are selling, and not what you have decided on, you will never be satisfied.
Decide what you want to spend, and live with it, IMO the days of discounts, for 4R's are over at this time. The Tacomas now are discounted, not the 4R's.
I am driving 945 miles for this deal, VIN: JTEVA5BR2S5004371.
Crank

 

[brumey]

My 4Runner is apparently on the boat with a delivery to dealer expected in late March. The sales guy at the dealer said they do not charge above MSRP. The cost detail sheet they sent me prior to me putting a deposit showed MSRP pricing with one junk extra, the paint protection which is mandatory on all they sell. It had a high doc fee of $700.

I am hoping they don’t screw with the pricing when I go to pick it up. If they do, I will walk.

Does anyone know if the numbers they give you prior to the deposit are locked in?

 

[toyomoLC]

It’sa timing issue, in part. Just as the Taco supppy has started to meet constrained demand, so will the 4R supply. Prices will then drop. e may even see discounts.

I had a conversation yesterday with someone with deep relationships in the Toyota truck industry. He pointed out that the supply of Toyota trucks at the local and regional dealers has started to build up and they’re having a tough time moving them off the lots.
Banks here are reluctant to finance amounts above MSRP. He gave me several examples of buyers he knows as clients who can afford to write a check and buy 4Rs, Tundras, Tacos, LRs outright who have decided not to do so because of the seemingly unreasonable prices set by Toyota and the shenanigans by some dealers. Those of us in that category have just decided to sit it out, not buy a new 6th Gen 4R and see when rationality returns before deciding whether to buy.

in my case I decided I’ll buy a 5th Gen 4R - if I can find a reasonable deal - so I’ve just cast a wider multi-state net for a good 2023 or 2024 4R, after driving a new LC and a 6th Gen 4R. I like and appreciate the new 6th Gen tech - TSS 3.0 in my 2025 Signia is great - but I’d rather keep it simple in a 4R. No hybrid if I went that direction as the turbo’s power is enough for me without another system to worry about. YMMV

Still think Toyota has made some fundamental errors in pricing, in oversegmenting the market sector, and in timing of supply. Dealers and distributors loading many 4Rs with useless options many off us don’t want -strictly fit their profit - hasn’t helped.

Their current trickle supply & overoption approach definitely advantages Toyota and their USA dealers, but it’s leaving a very sour taste in the mouth of some of us who have been long term loyal customers. It’ll take a long time to get over that impression. Toyota may be betting on a new generation of customers who value immediacy and convenience over brand relationship. We’ll see if it works.

This is coming from someone whose immediate family has owned and regularly driven 9 Toyota/Lexus vehicles in the past 30 years and in which several of us have practiced and are experts in TPS/Lean production. It’s not a pretty picture we are watching.
Buying used instead of new may start to send a message to the Toyota USA decision makers and their marketing team.

 

[johnd]

Are you sure there was not a misunderstanding? Nobody on this forum has posted anything near $23k above MSRP.

Absolutely sure. They were claiming it was because it’d be the first TRD Pro for a long time in Las Vegas. The funny part is that the week after, another dealership reached out with a $10K markup. I’ve decided to wait and see.

 

[HVLA]

I agree. I initially hated the 6G based on pics. After researching hundreds od videos/reviews/this forum it has grown on me. However, the ridiculous hoops to jump through on finding a vehicle optioned how I want is just tiring. I have owned 3 4runners, 1 tacoma, and 3 GXs. Toyota/Lexus is all I will ever buy/own. This whole thing has me soured and I will wait it out to see if I can find something reasonable 6 months or a year from now.

Or maybe just buy a used GX.

 

[Dead Horse]

Banks here are reluctant to finance amounts above MSRP. He gave me several examples of buyers he knows as clients who can afford to write a check and buy 4Rs, Tundras, Tacos, LRs outright who have decided not to do so because of the seemingly unreasonable prices set by Toyota and the shenanigans by some dealers. Those of us in that category have just decided to sit it out, not buy a new 6th Gen 4R and see when rationality returns before deciding whether to buy.

Still think Toyota has made some fundamental errors in pricing, in oversegmenting the market sector, and in timing of supply. Dealers and distributors loading many 4Rs with useless options many off us don’t want -strictly fit their profit - hasn’t helped.

Their current trickle supply & overoption approach definitely advantages Toyota and their USA dealers, but it’s leaving a very sour taste in the mouth of some of us who have been long term loyal customers. It’ll take a long time to get over that impression. Toyota may be betting on a new generation of customers who value immediacy and convenience over brand relationship. We’ll see if it works.

I am so.very.tired of their crap. Toyota jacking prices 20% over the last few years, PLUS every other step in the process putting two hands in the cookie jar and adding another 10-15%.

 

[Dead Horse]

Pretty funny considering where the economy is gonna be in a few months.

Unemployment will be rising (I promise you this), consumer confidence is currently the lowest in 12 years, prices on everything keeps going up, gas is still high and auto loan delinquencies are at pre great recession levels, combined with record $1.7T consumer debt (that's trillion).

I'd laugh at him and tell him to have a nice day. In a few months they will be begging for business.

That guy will be out of a job in two months.

It's already slowed down quite a bit. I probably won't bite until there's about eight grand on the hood and no Gulf States Toyota bullshit. So either I wait a long time, or they simply don't get my money LOL

There's an OR-P Tacoma hybrid at the local dealer here. It's been there for close to three months I think. Sales guy keeps calling me and telling me a lower amount. They're 5k off so far. That's a LOT for the hybrids. Even Trailhunters and Pros are getting discounts and sitting a while.

 

[HVLA]

Always be prepared to walk. Never go into a dealership NEEDING a vehicle.

 

[Dead Horse]

Yes, this is how I operate as well. If I can't get the deal I want, I walk, and that also may mean not buying a vehicle. I've walked outa dealers more times than I can count and felt better every single time. I equate extra fees with walking into a dealer with a briefcase of case. Would I ever walk into a dealer with a breifcase loaded with greenbacks? Hell no, so why would I let a dealer add costs to a vehicle I'm interested in buying. Just the whole dealer mindset is so slimy that I won't walk in until I've talked to someone and have numbers negotiated. It's just not worth my time to drive down and get frustrated with their BS. I guess the rich and the inexperienced have allowed dealers to get this far with their approach.

No lie. I always feel like I need a shower after talking to half those guys.

The last several years, Toyota dealers have jacked their profit margins halfway to Mars, and they're gonna fight for every dollar as it comes back down too. It's going to get rough out there.

 

[Racinwith8]

Did see this at Voss, outside of Dayton, OH. May be a bait to get you there to say it sold or have a bunch of BS dealer installed crap. This is the first alleged discounted unit I’ve seen my area of Cincinnati. I got my wife’s Sport premium at MSRP, which from what I can tell in my area is the norm. It’s still on the other side of the pond in processing at the port.

 

[rdk654]

I was lured by a dealership in Las Vegas under the premise that they had allocation for a TRD Pro. Ended up marking up $23,000 above MSRP. Absolutely ridiculous.

Here in Nj, went to dealership to get a sport premium listed at 60k on window sticker. Took the test drive and went to purchase. Thats when they told me there was going to be a markup and told me all dealerships were doing it. Would t tell me how much. Called another dealership down the street and was informed the first dealership was a private dealer and they can do what they want but the one I was speaking too would honor the msrp.

 

[ModernDay4Runner]

Absolutely sure. They were claiming it was because it’d be the first TRD Pro for a long time in Las Vegas. The funny part is that the week after, another dealership reached out with a $10K markup. I’ve decided to wait and see.

Wow. Maybe they are thinking that some Vegas High Roller will have no qualms paying that much.

 

[ModernDay4Runner]

The “Outrageous dealer pricing currently” topic was originally my reply to another post about someone paying $75K for a Gen 6 4Runner. I saw on the sidebar on this forum that a moderator decided that this reply should be its own separate thread topic and retitled it.

I think the responses have uncovered that the 6Gen staff may be Toyota insiders -marketers or some of the parasitic ‘influencers’ I cited. Many of them make a living out of making videos about installing accessories and parts they get for free from suppliers and manufacturers. To each his own in a capitalistic society - I applaud them - but these people are not the typical Toyota buyer or user. They’re outliers as reflected in the nonsensical option combos most of us don’t want and are being forced fed.

Still think that the Toyota USA SUV/truck marketing team and its lead were unduly influenced by the ‘youtuber influencer’ & ‘overland expo’ gang. They have over-segmented the 4Runner Gen6/LC offerings and they are testing the Nash equilibrium with their overinflated pricing. That sales volume curve drops fairly steeply once the inelastic unit price point is exceeded. They’re close.

The dealers are not helping with useless tack-on accessory profit-driven pricing models and ‘market adjustments’. The problem may be worse in SET, but it’s not limited to my local market or to a single dealer. Not all dealers do it but enough do thate they smear the rest. One dealer in an adjoining state tried to charge me for a 2nd key fob for a TRD ORP 4Runner.

Obviously Toyota’s scheme of trickling the supply slowly is markedly distorting the market. They’ve always constrained supply to drive residual value and maintain inflated new truck pricing.

In the end, Toyota’s reputation is shattered, from my perspective, and they’ve decided to cater to the relatively few ‘internet Toyota influencers’ who make a living out of mods on their trucks by getting freebies from the suppliers, installers and Toyota aftermarket producers.

A pretty sleazy situation for an old line Japanese company that had spent so much of its storied history defending ‘human dignity’ through Lean/TPS innovation and quality. This new approach, at least in the USA, belies all that rhetoric as BS and a devout commitment to profit over quality.

Toyota seems to have lost its way.

Akio Toyoda-Sama, would you consider that the time has come for you to intervene in the USA market to correct the questionable dealer/distributor practices and misguided marketing strategy that are dishonoring Toyota’s reputation? Given the Toyoda family’s commitments to its loyal brand customer base, your leadership action now, to allow your customer’s who work hard to continue to afford your truck products, is the honorable course.

A couple things:

• "Obviously Toyota’s scheme of trickling the supply slowly is markedly distorting the market. They’ve always constrained supply to drive residual value and maintain inflated new truck pricing." Why then do you think they've recently lost their way? Non-sequitur
• If you think Akio Toyoda-Sama will take your sage advice, you may be giving yourself a bit too much credit or taking yourself a bit too seriously.
• Finally, I think you need to give us Gen 6 buyers a bit more credit. Looking at the distribution among these age groups of buyers and soon-to-be buyers, I highly doubt parasitic/you-tube influencers are the main reason people in these age groups are purchasing a new 4Runner.

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